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Re: Lots of thoughts


Message written by

Craig
September 05, 2007 at 14:28:39:

In Reply to
Re: Lots of thoughts
posted by
Bonnie
September 04, 2007 at 03:14:08:

 
Hello Bonnie,

You wrote,
I have also been a Lutheran my whole life, by the way.

I also was reared Lutheran. My cousin and his two children are Lutheran ministers and I graduated from Thiel College, a Lutheran school. Today, I don't affiliate with any religion, although for a while I was a member of the Spiritualist church in Leroy. The Spiritualist churches are watered-down Evangelical churches without a focus on spiritual growth, so I stopped going.

You wrote,
You said, "It’s the intention to pray that’s important—the prayer is just the outward evidence of the intention." Sometimes I just sort of have the thoughts without saying the words. I am assuming that God knows my thoughts. Is that what you are referring to?

Yes. But don’t think of God as some divine being outside of you. You are one with God as well. There is nothing but God. All of existence has at its basis, God. We are one with God. We do have free will, though. All of humankind is evolving to be more spiritually mature, and that evolution is proceeding based on our individual spiritual growth. It isn’t predetermined. So when you feel compassion, that feeling adds to the spirituality of the world and your own spirituality. It’s your spiritual state overall that makes a difference, and the basis of all being, who is one with you, God, knows that state without your having to use words. The words are the way you communicate it to yourself.

You wrote,
I hope to learn more about Revelation real soon. I saw what you said about the hell "myth". Believe me, I have struggled with the concept for many reasons many times. However, because of the different spheres that are perhaps in the afterlife, I imagine that some low planes could be somewhat hell like. I don't wish that on anyone.

Yes, those on the next planes of life describe lower spheres where people’s lives are “darker.” But it isn’t punishment or revenge, and there’s no torture. Punishment and torture are primitive, physical realm conceptions. Instead, because the person and the others on that plane are all filled with anger and insensitivity, as they were on the Earth plane, they’re living lives in anger and insensitivity. They can’t physically hurt others there, but they can be harsh with them. Their personalities continue. But those people who have that spiritual condition are together, so they make life unpleasant for themselves and those around them. However, people from higher planes are continually working with them to try to help them mature out of that. Eventually they will. Eventually everyone matures spiritually. We have an eternity to work on it.

You wrote,
Now back to my reconciliation struggle. You said, "No, that would require forcing a person to change beliefs." I'm not sure what beliefs would need to be changed. It just seems to me like hearts need to be changed, and somewhere along the line, I got the idea that there would be a great reconciliation in heaven and that all would be right again with God's entire creation.

No. Nothing happens against our will. If there is reconciliation, it will be because each person involved has a change of heart, on their own, just as anyone might have a change of heart on the Earth plane. There is no magical dust that angels sprinkle on people to make them pleasant and loving. We continue to grow spiritually just as we do on the Earth plane. We may go into other spheres where we learn lessons, or return to the Earth plane to learn lessons. But the lessons are learned just as they are now on this plane of existence. No magical reconciliation will happen. Whatever goes on with each individual is entirely in his or her control.

You wrote,
You said, "If he turns away, there’s no hope for him in that condition." My understanding is that fundamentalists believe the "no hope" part is hell. What do you mean by "no hope"? In spiritualism, couldn't a person grow and advance through the "spheres" whenever he/she is ready?

Yes. I didn’t mean “no hope” suggesting that nothing would ever change. It’s just that if a person is stuck in a belief system, no one can make him change. It’s just like people on the Earth plane who are determined to stay angry with someone their entire life and are successful. As long as they’re choosing to be in that position, no one can do anything for them. They have to decide to change.

You cited Matthew 18:17: "If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church; and if he refuses to listen even to the church, treat him as you would a pagan or a tax collector."

Much of what you read in the gospels, especially the later gospels, was never said by Yeshua (Jesus). This is an example. We know that because the writer of Matthew has the passages in Matthew 18 alone and they fit with the tenor of the book of Matthew, but not with Mark and the Q source, the earliest texts. Read the passages in Mark where Yeshua refers to tax collectors and you’ll see that he was always accepting and loving toward them. These words in Matthew would never come from his lips.

I don’t know whether you’ve seen my Web site at http://30ce.com, but you’ll find more about the hell myth there.

Love and peace, Craig
 



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